Don Lemon clashed with former CIA official and CNN contributor Phil Mudd on Thursday’s Don Lemon Tonight over whether or not former President Donald Trump knowingly took part in a conspiracy to overturn the election, which would have effectively overthrown American democracy. The argument centered around if the former president actually knew whether he had won or lost the election, or if he knew he’d lost but pushed the fraud narrative anyway in an attempt to stay in power. Multiple former White House staffers and campaign staffers have testified to the Jan. 6 Committee that they told Trump that he’d lost the election, and that claims otherwise were false. Mudd doesn’t buy that every advisor told the former president the truth.
“Every single person who testified,” Lemon said, “his advisors told him — and I’m not saying you’re wrong, I’m saying on this one, every advisor — on this one you’re wrong — every single advisor told him that he lost.” “No, you’re wrong,” Mudd retorted. “No, Don, you’re wrong!”
Mudd argued that if Trump were to be taken to trial for conspiracy, it would not stick.
“You said that the president’s advisors told him that he won,” Lemon said. “Not one of the president’s advisors told him he won.” “I don’t buy it,” Mudd replied. “I’m telling you, defense attorneys are gonna find people who say the president thought he won.”
In response, Lemon argued that the dozens of lawsuits the former president’s legal team lost while attempting to prove voter fraud should be sufficient evidence that Trump knew he had lost the election.
“When he had 60 different court cases, there is no way in hell that he thought that he won, and no one with any sense told him that he won,” Lemon said. “You’re not making sense, I’m sorry. You’re not making sense right now, Phil.”
But Mudd believes that Trump’s former advisors likely told him something different than what they are now telling the January 6th Committee.
“I’m asking you to tell me one person who’s told — one advisor, legitimate advisor, who testified to the committee, and they told him that Donald Trump won,” Lemon said. Mudd responded, “Because they told the committee something different than they told the president.”
Don Lemon Tonight airs weeknights at 10 p.m. on CNN.
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